Thursday, June 25, 2009

Blog Entry dated 6/25/2009 6:48 AM

http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/myth/suckers.htm

Methinks the 'Amway experience' is a suckers' game - it takes suckers to make it work. For every person that "makes it", many, many more do not, cannot, for the numbers are against them. But, I guess, that's the price some people are willing to pay for the dream of being financially independent.

But nobody ever really gets financially independent in the 'Amway experience'. The people that "make it" are dependent on the hundreds and thousands of suckers below them who must be continually deceived into thinking that one day they too will "make it", so that they will continue to buy over-priced products and motivational dreck. Yet, even though the numbers are against them, - yea, and the numbers speak loudly - the masses refuseth to wake up.

Methinks it's like a carnival where folk pay to go on joy rides. At the circus called 'The Amway Experience', suckers spend money and life energy for the thrill of having the dream of being free. Instead of putting their energies into legitimate endeavors to get free, they fritter away clutching the illusion. They probably know they never will be free, but that's probably why they do the joy rides, because they're safe. They don't have to think.

Alas, the numbers are against them. Poor suckers!


Wednesday, June 10, 2009

Rip-off Report: AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

Its pretty darn obvious what the majority of the people think about this company. Why is it that people still sign up for it? Is it because they are so desperate for a job they will resort to anything with the slight promise of success? Or is it because they buy into the story that they can retire in 2-5 years?

Even the worst businesses dont get this much negative attention.  That speaks volumes to its legitamacy.

 

 

Quoted from http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/003/RipOff0003443.htm#360899:

Rip-off Report: AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

I'm sorry, did you say that this was a BUSINESS????

It is a SCAM. I don't care WHAT you call it. I was approached by a FORMER friend about Quixstar. I went to the meeting and the 'IBO' made his pitch. One of the things that the said repeatedly was that 'it was not Amway.' What a lie!!!! It was started by Amway and is basically the same thing as Amway. And I got that information from the official website.

As a licensed private investigator in two states, I can be called an 'independent business owner.' Amway folks are not business owners. Oh, btw, most states lump MLMs and Pyramid schemes together. The only difference is that MLMs can be legit at times.

Tuesday, June 9, 2009

Amway and Quixtar Scam

Yup... I still havent figured out why people fall for this.... maybe its just greed at its finest.

Quoted from http://www.corporatenarc.com/quixtar.php:

Amway and Quixtar Scam

you will end up alienating some family and friends. You will probably end up buying more stuff than you sell. And you will learn a lot about deceiving yourself and others.

Monday, June 8, 2009

MLM Survivors Homepage. Headlines and breaking news about Amway and other Multi-Level Marketing businesses

Microsoft calls ANYONE that buys their operating system a partner.  Thats an interesting trick to try and make it more than it is so that they can hook another member for their downline.

Quoted from http://www.mlmsurvivor.com/quixtarupdate.htm:

MLM Survivors Homepage. Headlines and breaking news about Amway and other Multi-Level Marketing businesses

Quixtar and Microsoft

Many IBOs are claiming that Microsoft and Quixtar are "partners." I’ve received the following:

"the deboss [sic] and van andel families fronted the money for MICROSOFT to develop quixtar."

"And they say their technology partners are IBM, Cambell Ewald, Microsoft, and Fry Multi media, what is their involvement in this?"

"It was promoted to me as a business started by Microsoft, IBM and the 'Owners of the Orlando Magic.' "

"Do you think that Microsoft and FRye multimedia (Tada) and IBM are stupid. Do you think that they are partnering with us for nothing?"

"I was contacted today by a representative of Amway following up on a report I submitted to the Better Business Bureau. Her main point in addressing my grievance was 'The disclaimer has been modified so that all references to Bill Gates and Donald Trump have been modified so as not to establish a false relationship between Quixtar and those businesses belonging to the aforementioned'. "

What does Amway say? According to their Quixtar information web site,

"Also please disregard any rumors/reports that state specific well-known individuals (e.g., Bill Gates, Donald Trump) are involved in the QUIXTAR business, as those reports are untrue."

Amway Speaks: Memorable Quotes

Follow the link... there are a ton more quotes from the leaders of Amway with their foot in their mouths.

Quoted from http://www.rickross.com/reference/amway/amway10.html:

Amway Speaks: Memorable Quotes

Amway Speaks: Memorable Quotes


"Of course, there is a danger here. Along the way we may envision scenarios that are unrealistic. I would love to sing like Pavarotti or pass like Joe Montana or shoot like magic Johnson, or write like Toni Morrison. It is real important to get regular reality checks from those we love and trust. On occasion unrealistic dreams become obsessive and need a counselor's help"
--Rich DeVos Co-founder of Amway page 23 Compassionate Capitalism

"We’re just pleased to move on," Amway’s Meurlin said. "Stacy Hanrahan and the other plaintiffs had a very abnormal experience with the company."
--Craig "Pinocchio" Meurlin, senior vice president of Amway, commenting on the Hanrahan lawsuit which charged that distributors were being lied to about distributor incomes and being coerced by their uplines into buying motivational tools.

"So I am talking about $100,000 that you can make in your spare time without giving up what you do during the day."
--Amway distributor caught lying at recruitment meeting by hidden camera, American Journal, 2/14/94

"We have a major lawsuit going on right now with an attorney general in one of the states based on people making what they say are excess claims and telling people they hardly have to work at all, telling them you can make $50,000.00 a year and you only have to work twelve hours a week. Now, you and I both know, you know, that--that just can't be put up with."
--Rich Devos, co-founder of Amway, from a "Directly Speaking" tape, 1983

Qbay - Real E-commerce for IBOs

Another Dummies book... too funny

 

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/humor/qbay/qbay1.html:

Qbay - Real E-commerce for IBOs

Starting a Quixtar "Qbay" Business

Ever wonder how your upline does their 150PV month after month?

Ever wonder how you can do your 150 PV points with Quixtar to support your team goals and not feel like a loser and yet not drown in After-Eight CoffeeTM, LOCTM , SA8TM laundry detergent, or Double XTM vitamins?

Ever wonder how you can reduce your cost of purchasing your 150PV points from Quixtar?

Quixtar's Director of Misinformation announces 2005 Business Results

Im not sure how to catagorize this one...

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/humor/sales_2005/sales_2005.html:

Quixtar's Director of Misinformation announces 2005 Business Results

"Sales were $1.058 billion -- the third consecutive year over a billion dollars.  Also, IBO efforts resulted in a record $76 million in revenues for Quixtar's Partner Stores. For their marketing and business-building efforts, IBOs earned $345 million in bonuses and other incentives.   woohoo!.  It was a great year!", noted Baghdad Bob.


Critics were quick to make a critical analysis of Quixtar's performance.  A closer look at the results showed that Quixtar sales actually fell 3.8% over 2004, despite having price increases in the product line and despite recruiting over 150,000 new distributors.   Pay outs to distributors dropped 7.5% from $373 to $345 million.  Commissions as a percentage of sales fell from 31.9% to 30.4% of sales.  Partner store sales were at $76 million or only 8.5% from the year 2000 results of $70 or just a 1.7% annual growth rate.  Taking into account inflation, real partner store sales are probably lower than those of 2000.

Despite the disappointing results, Baghdad Bob's famous bubbling optimism shows through with his final statement,  "Personally, I think the best is yet to come.  It's hard not to when there's so much cool stuff going on here at Quixtar.  New programs.  New products.  New ideas.  It's never been better."

Brian Buckley of Barnes & Noble Talks About the Quixtar Business

If you dont want to be approached by an Amway/Quixtar IBO then maybe its best to steer clear of Barnes and Nobles. I have been lucky so far and have not been approached by anyone in Barnes and Nobles... which just happens to be my favorite bookstore (besides Amazon.com).

 

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/humor/thisbiznow/bn.htm:

Brian Buckley of Barnes & Noble Talks About the Quixtar Business

“However the partnership with Quixtar brought to us for the first time a huge problem in our stores. Ninety percent of the solicitation complaints we get in our stores come from Quixtar IBOs trying to pitch the business on our normal customers."

“A poll conducted by Barnes & Noble of the managers of our more than 700 stores identified Quixtar IBOs as the most frequent violator of our store policy, with no other company-related group in second."

Tuesday, June 2, 2009

Part 1: Amway Is Your Friend

I think I have posted from this site before.  Regardless, its worth noting again if I have.  Some people are easily hooked by the "car salesman" like slipperiness of a firm handshake and warm smile.  Its not an art to be able to trick someone into seeing your product, its a level of slumminess (is that a word?) that a person must sink to in order to hook your fish.  The promise of a shortcut to riches opens up some very interesting character traits and reveals many for the true person they are.

Quoted from http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/amstory1.html:

Part 1: Amway Is Your Friend

Part 1: Amway is your friend.

I was in a computer store one day browsing for games. Standing next to me was a middle-aged gentleman in a business suit whom I'll call "Ted." Ted was enthusiastically sifting through lots of games, looking excitedly at the pictures on the backs of the boxes. He made a comment out loud, which I decided to pick up on. "Isn't it amazing what they're doing these days?" he said with a big grin. I replied by commenting on the game industry -- where I think they're headed, what's right and wrong with today's games -- and immediately he acted fascinated by what I said. He wanted to hear more of my opinions, so I innocently told him that I was a computer science student in my fourth year of college, working part-time as a scientific programmer, planning to get involved with the game industry soon, then eventually to build a company so I could write my own games. He said I sounded like a bright young man and he wanted to do whatever he could to help advance my career.

Saturday, May 30, 2009

Pyramid Scheme Alert

I was told by a potential recruit that the lawsuits had determined that Amway/Quixtar was a legitimate business.  It appears that is quite true as there are a great many suits out there.

Quoted from http://www.pyramidschemealert.org/PSAMain/news/AmwaySuedasPyramidScheme.html:

Pyramid Scheme Alert

January, 2007

In a crucial development that could rock the entire multi-level marketing business, a class action lawsuit has been filed this month against Quixtar (Amway) charging that the company is running an illegal pyramid scheme. (filed in US District court in the northern district of California on January 10, 2007, case number 3:07-cv-00201-EMC.)

The charges against Amway/Quixtar go to the very heart of the company's business practices and most other multi-level marketing (MLM) schemes', that there is no retail "direct selling" opportunity, only an endless chain recruitment program.

The charges are being brought by one of America's most powerful law firms, Boies, Schiller and Flexner. David Boies of this firm represented Vice-President Al Gore in front of the US Supreme Court in the world famous case, Gore vs. Bush that contested the vote counting in Florida after the 2000 election. The other firm partnering with Boies, Schiller & Flexner in the suit is Gary, Williams, Parenti, Finney, Lewis, McManus, Watson, & Sperando, P.L.. in Stuart, Florida. This firm has a powerful track record of successful class action suits against large companies.

Friday, May 29, 2009

Amway

This article in its entirety is worth reading.  It outlines how an IBO tricked him into an initial meeting and outright lied that it was not Amway.  Why do these millionaires and wealthy people need to resort to these tricks and tactics?  Its becoming very evident that for some reason, people dont use their heads when confronted with a possibility of untold riches and cars and houses.....

Quoted from http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/amway.htm:

Amway

Read what an expert in organised crime thinks about Amway.

"It is my opinion that the Amway business is run in a manner that is parallel to that of major organized crime groups, in particular the Mafia. The structure and function of major organized crime groups, generally consisting of associated enterprises engaging in patterns of legal and illegal activity, was the prototype forming the basis for federal and state racketeering legislation that I have been involved in drafting. The same structure and function, with associated enterprises engaging in patterns of legal and illegal activity, is found in the Amway business."

Amway Hate Mail

Amway, Scientology, Cultism.... it appears those terms share a common theme.  I found a site where a reporter went undercover and joined Amway/Quixtar and interviewed a "millionaire" just to find out he was lying through his teeth... I will post it when I run across it again.

Quoted from http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Amway/hate-mail.html:

Amway Hate Mail

I used to ignore the hate mail I received from Amway cultists, but I've decided as of May 2001 to publish selected entries as they come in. These notes are very similar to the angry mail I get from Scientologists. The common themes are:
  • Anyone who criticizes Amway/Scientology is evil, or at best seriously misinformed.
  • The "Amway system" (or Scientology "spiritual technology") always works when applied correctly. Anyone who fails to achieve the miraculous results they were promised has only themselves to blame; they clearly didn't try hard enough.
  • If I don't want to do Amway (or Scientology), that's my choice. But why am I trying to "ruin things" for other people? (Amway cultists say "steal their dreams"; Scientology cultists say "prevent others from getting better".)
  • People like me who criticize Amway/Scientology are pathetic failures who have no life, no money, and no future. In Scientology they're SPs (Suppressive Persons); in Amway they're "broke losers".

10.html

A letter found with a random search.  Its amazing how far people will sacrifice themselves for the promise of money and riches.

Quoted from http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/amo/10.html:

10.html

Dear Ashley,

I applaud your taking the time to write down your Amway story. I wish more "Amway Losers" would take time to do so. My best friend and her husband are being lured into Amway and are at "leadership" in California as I write (while I have 2 of their 3 kids, so much for spending time with your family on a holiday weekend). You have opened my eyes to the beast and I cannot believe the incredible negligence of a company and it's total disregaurd for self pride and the family unit. You have made me aware of Amway's cultic persuation and I have in return been able to defend myself as I approached my friend regarding my concerns in their involvement with such a scam. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I would send 200 "thank-yous" but I'm not a freak! Your information has been invaluable! J Mitchell

Thursday, May 28, 2009

Gmail - Merchants of Deception update and UK info - brdngna@gmail.com

I guess its true what they say.  If it sounds too good to be true then it probably is.  I am just amazed at the devotion these "believers" exhibit.   I say "believers" because there are very little facts and the victims appear to be taking someone elses word for all the riches to be achieved.

Quoted from https://mail.google.com/mail/?account_id=brdngna%40gmail.com&zx=sdol4qtzn92c&shva=1#inbox/121762384c3a0b63:

Gmail - Merchants of Deception update and UK info - brdngna@gmail.com

I have been contacted by two different IBO's in the UK
who estimate they each lost the equivalent of near $60,000
USD over years in an Amway motivational group.

Law enforcement officials in India raided Amway offices
and filed an action against the company. The local paper
reported that Amway was accused of "running a National Scam".

You can review multiple updates at http://merchantsofdeception.com/news.html

These Merchants of Deception updates will be few as
I do not want you to ever feel like you are receiving too
many e-mails. As critical news develops, you will be notified

Wednesday, May 27, 2009

YouTube - Scam=Quixtar=Amway=Alticor-(Part1)

Im going to try this again and embed the video...

Quoted from http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot31XhgE_XE:

YouTube - Scam=Quixtar=Amway=Alticor-(Part1)

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/ot31XhgE_XE&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/ot31XhgE_XE&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

YouTube - Scam=Quixtar=Amway=Alticor-(Part1)

Watch this youtube video from a news station... Im at a loss for words on this one.  Simply amazing...

Quoted from http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot31XhgE_XE:

YouTube - Scam=Quixtar=Amway=Alticor-(Part1)

Scam=Quixtar=Amway=Alticor-(Part1)

Friday, May 22, 2009

Amway or Scamway

Even IF Amway was legitimate, who would sign up for it given the tons of bad PR?

Quoted from http://www.caic.org.au/commercial/amway/scamway.htm:

Amway or Scamway

XENITH
THE TERRORIST OF TRUTH
AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

You decide....

Thursday, May 21, 2009

Amway Mail, Page 41

This seems to be a common story among ex Amway people. 

Quoted from http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/mail/amreply41.html:

Amway Mail, Page 41

I lost a lot of friends, we were also told that if people had a negative reaction to the Oppotunity or were not interested, then they were not worth associating ourselves with. Since quitting (yes, I will say the word QUIT), I am now driving my own Mercedes (hard earnt and not a company perk) and living in a large house on a prestigous estate and I have never looked back. My ex-sponsors have since quit, are very successful consultants and we are starting to talk again. My husband will not hear the word Amway mentioned in front of him. My Father In Law has since quit and now he and my Mother In Law are getting on again. The Amway practices have a lot to answer for. I have also since been approached twice, the first time, the guy kept bugging me and would not leave me alone for months, I considered reporting him as a stalker (no joke!), eventually, I put my husband on the line and he hasn't called since. I didn't even know they guy! The more recent approach is from a friend. I haven't told him to not go for it, he knows I have been involved before and asked about my experience, and that is all I stressed to him...that it was my experience. So he has struck me off his list. I'm still young, I have a long way to go...my way. Thanks for listening, this is probably the first time in 7 years I have been able to get this off my chest.

Amway Quixtar Business Myths - 18 reasons Quixtar is not Amway

I didnt realize that Quixtar was intended to be different from Amway. As far as their marketing goes they seemed to have failed.

 

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/amquix_differences.html:

Amway Quixtar Business Myths - 18 reasons Quixtar is not Amway

Why did they make Quixtar versus calling it Amway Online and keeping it in Amway?

  1. The Amway name was old and tarnished. Jay Leno was even making jokes about Amway distributors on TV.
  2. A tremendous portion of the value in any company is in its distribution system and network. Without the distributors, Amway is worthless. Since Rich and Jay are getting on in age, any estate taxes on the Amway business will be staggering. Quixtar is owned by the children of Rich and Jay. So in effect, a huge portion of the value of the Amway family business has been transferred to the children free of any estate taxes. Since the distributors via their own free will have transferred to Quixtar there is no taxable transaction. This is a tremendous coup and has saved the family millions in estate taxes!

Amway: The Untold Story: Your Comments 6

Im not the only one who thinks of Amway recruiters are like car salesmen.  I have met a couple people who sold cars that was decent.  However, I have met a lot of them that are as slimey and deal wheeling as they come.  Its for that reason alone that I buy my cars through Costco.

Quoted from http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Amway/AUS/comment6.htm:

Amway: The Untold Story: Your Comments 6

I attended the meeting and of course I was asked to sit in the front of the room. The guy doing the speaking was an ex-car salesman which made me feel a bit uneasy right there. The bulk of the meeting was spent dredging up the newbies' so-called "lost dreams". It was nauseating. This meeting gave a new meaning to the Golden Calf. I deliberatly did not make eye-contact with this slippery eel because I would have told him exactly what I thought of the whole thing. But, I didn't want to make a scene. One poor fellow was asked: "What would you like to have that you don't have now?". The guy responded by saying "I really don't need anything that I can think of." For this, he was all but hissed down and the speaker said "Sombody check his pulse to see if he's alive!" Laughter ensued, of course. It was shameful. I almost felt dirty just being there.

All of this went on for about 40 minutes. Not until *the last 20 minutes* did the speaker reveal that it was Amway. Red flag #2. Why didn't he just come right out and say it from the get-go? I know why. They pump you up, make you feel like a loser trodden down by "corporate America". And that, although your *dreams* may have died on the vine, there is hope, the Church Universal of Amway International!. But only to a priveldged few mind you. Yep, lucky me!

Amway Functions Suck!

Wow.... you would think that would be enough for someone to figure it out. 

Quoted from http://amwayfunctions.blogspot.com/:

Amway Functions Suck!

Thursday, May 14, 2009

Amway WWDB - G.O.O.D.

G.O.O.D. is an acronym for get out of debt. When I saw the business plan, I remember the speaker talking about Quixtar now Amway being a way to get out of debt. The presenter mentioned that many Americans are in debt and that too many people overuse their credit cards. He said one of the things that WWDB teaches is for people to get out of debt. It was one of the things that attracted me to the business opportunity. When I joined, I was not really in debt, but at the same time I did not have a lot of savings and I was looking for ways to get ahead. There were times when I made large purchases on my credit card and it would take 2-3 months to pay off. I figured I could make enough extra cash to pay some ongoing bills like my rent and be able to save up for my future.

One thing that was confusing to me though, was our uplines telling us that we should get out of debt, but at the same time, telling the group to do whatever it took to attend that next function or to continue to be core. It was touted as investing in ourselves. The scam finally came to an end for me when I happened to overhear some crossline talking to each other. One guy mentioned that he was going into debt BECAUSE of the business and could not afford to keep on going. I stepped forward and told these fellas that I was feeling the same thing. So that nite after a team meeting, we sort of talked about our situations very frankly and concluded that we had made a msitake in joining Quixtar now Amway, mainly because the ongoing cost of the business expenses. Yes, the start up cost was low, and the overhead wasn't exorbitant, but after a waking up, I tallied up my bonuses and then my expenses and I had lost thousands of dollars over my short stint in the business. But it's sneaky because you don't spend a lot all at once. You are slowly drained of your income on what seems like reaonable business expenses. It is only when I looked at the business with a critical eye that I realized what had happened. Posted by Derek at 5:45 PM 0 comments

Amway - The Dream Or The Scheme?

I may have posted something similar... regardless, here it is...

 

Quoted from http://amwayscheme.blogspot.com/:

Amway - The Dream Or The Scheme?

Amway - The Business Works If You Work It?

The business works if you work it! That's what many Amway enthusiats will claim. I do not believe that is true and I will further explain in this post. Many IBOs who claim that the business works are usually new and are unable to show any evidence that the business works, except perhaps to show a photocopied check from an upline diamond or the like.

Let me make a disclaimer that some people do make significant money from Amway, but most of those folks are tenured diamonds who are almost in an exclusive club. There is only a short list of new diamonds that I know of in the US, and I have heard that even these new diamonds may have had legs in other countries. It would seem that Amway is not growing in the US and Canada. Also of note, Amway did not release figures that are seperate between Amway North America and the rest of their overseas operations.

Blog Entry dated 5/21/2009 12:05 AM

Here is an interesting link with a good deal of traffic on it....


http://www.webraw.com/quixtar/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4634

Wednesday, May 20, 2009

UplineLies.html

Some of this is starting to sound familiar....

Quoted from http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/amo/UplineLies.html:

UplineLies.html

HARMFUL IDEA : If you can't have the lifestyle of an Amway diamond, i.e., sleep until noon, buy anything you want and walk the beaches everyday with your upline idols, you can't be happy. THE HARM: A psychologically manipulative idea perpetuated to shift and solidify a distributor's loyalty to the Amway business and the AMO cult. Part of the programming that destroys life long friendships, marriages and families.
**

HARMFUL IDEA: Your workplace is a prison and J.O.B. is a swear word.
THE HARM : Another psychologically manipulative idea persistently planted in distributors' minds to shift loyalty from their employer to Amway. Most of us have some dissatisfaction with our jobs but don't feel imprisoned by it. Many people lose promotions and sometimes their jobs because of the job apathy instilled in them by the AMO disparagement of jobs. Equally as important, the world would not function without the millions of non-Amway services provided by the work force. And, I ask, who would fill the needs of the many thousands of diamonds that, according to Bill Britt, will come from within his organization?
**
MISREPRESENTATION: Most people die or go broke not long after retirement.
REALITY : Some die. Some go broke. But the reality is most retirees live on reduced incomes which doesn't mean they're broke or any way diminished in their capacity to live comfortably and be happy. The perpetuation of this half-truth is simply a tactic used often by distributors to scare prospects into the Amway business which promises retirement in a state of wealth and security.
**
HARMFUL IDEA: Products that are not sold through the Amway or Personal Shoppers catalogs are negative and that if you buy them you are a "traitor".
THE HARM : Endless repetition of this idea conditions distributors to always buy Amway products or other products through their own business using the Amway Personal shoppers catalog. The family conflict this creates is pervasive and destabilizing. It can get to the point where the sight of something from the neighborhood grocery can cause internal bleeding. Of course, the real purpose of this idea is so top Amway distributors can get huge bonus checks without selling anything (but an idea ) to their vast organizations of downline distributors.
**
UNTRUTH: Creating the apparency of being more successful in the Amway business than you really are is not deceiving prospects, it's simply thinking diamond or dressing for success.
TRUTH : This is deception and misrepresentation in its most insidious form - a "let's fake it" tactic utilized for the purpose of luring people into Amway and getting them excited.
**

JohnDuff.html

Can this be for real? Who the heck talks like that? Does he think he is just going to wake up one day and have all this money? What happened to working for what you get. You know what they say, "if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is..."

I would be interested in where this guy is today and how he is doing.

 

Quoted from http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/amo/JohnDuff.html:

JohnDuff.html

The following is transcribed from an Amvox (Amway's voice mail service) message.

It is one of many hundreds of similar messages I received in two years of being on Amvox. Amvox is used as just another conduit for the "thought reform" process used by Amway Motivational Organizations in general. I chose this message because it is typical of the pervasive, contradictory, hypocritical and downright shameful worship of materialism that high-level distributors deny is there. I asked my upline diamond one day how Bill Britt (one of Amway's top distributors) could say possessions mean nothing while at the same time own 25 cars. He told me that "it's just part of God's law of compensation for all the people he's 'helped'." If you make it through this without getting queezy I suggest you join the nearest AMO and put five or six pictures of Lear Jets on your refrigerator.

Remote message from John Duff.


"Hey, Ed, man, John Duff here. I've gotten somethin' fired up I want to tell you about. I had one of the most unbelievable things happen to me today. I was sittin' downtown doin' the old J.O.B. routine, you know this thing that I'm gonna be totally free from here in just a short while and, uh, guess who walked by me? uh, it took me a couple of minutes to realize who it was. Brad Duncan. Yes, BRAD DUNCAN. He walked by. I tell you what, man, the guy was caz, not a care in the world, he walked with style and finesse, man, he was in jeans dungarees, the guy just looked so casual and I was on my way to the bank and I thought, man, hey, I have to find out where he's goin'. Hey, luckily, I FOUND him. He was at Nordstrom's, okay? He was down at Nordstrom's in the lady's department, uh, doin' somethin' and I walked in there and the sales woman walked up and says what are you doin', asked me if I needed help and I sez well I'm just kinda gettin' some ideas for Mother's day and that kinda thing, well, you KNOW what I wanted to do so I turned around and there's BRAD sittin' at the counter, Ed, and he's got a totally gorgeous diamond pendant or some type of diamond jewelry, just the BIGGEST most OUTRAGEOUSLY EXPENSIVE piece of jewelry that I could find that I'VE seen and he's telling the lady how beautiful his wife is and what she wears to these functions and meetings and I just, I couldn't help myself I HAD to butt in and I said Yeh, he's RIGHT, she IS a beautiful lady and he turned around and thanked me for the compliment and said Hi! I'm Brad Duncan and I shook his hand and told him who I was, that I'm in Freddy Davis's line of sponsorship and, man, Fred, I got excited. Because I I sat there and looked at him and he was just totally caz, not a care in the world, I mean the guy was able to get ANYTHING he wanted, anything his WIFE wanted, his heart desired. It was HIS. And I thought , THERE he is. I mean, what a LIFE. THe guy just walks into Nordstrom's and has no problem paying for this. Man, oh, man! YOu talk about freedom. You talk about a dream. Being able to get your wife anything there she wants. Ed, I was EXCITED. I'm STILL excited. I was jittery, I was nervous. I didn't know what to do but I shook his hand and talked with him for a couple minutes and that's about it. So anyway, Freddy, I wanted to share it with you because I'm fired up and excited. I love ya, buddy, I'll talk to you soon and, uh, I'll see ya.

 

amagram.html

This is an interesting perspective even though its mostly opinion based it also rings of common sense.

Quoted from http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/amo/amagram.html:

amagram.html

The Internet is simply a new medium of expression.

No. the Internet is a collossally new and EFFECTIVE medium of expression and Amway and AMO's are getting nervous. As they should. Because it will be the internet that will facilitate the grass roots movement that will put an end to AMO harm. Too many people have been harmed for this not to happen and the internet will be the vehicle.

As with all prospect concerns, here, too, the best approach is to listen carefully to what your prospects are saying, make sure you understand their specific objections, and then answer those objections as you would if they had obtained a less than complete and fair opinion of Amway through a relative, friend or newspaper story.

Upline distributors don't listen carefully to concerns and objections from prospects. They CAN'T. Their critical intelligence has been disabled by AMO mind control. They have canned responses to everything "negative" and are programmed not to listen at all, much less carefully.

To support you, ABN Amway Business Network has a section that provides information on many commonly asked questions about the Amway opportunity. The Amway websites also provide information about the Amway business and Amway distributors. And as always, you can contact your upline or Amway Corporation regarding specific questions or concerns.

Yes, get your information from Amway and your Amway recruiter or upline sponsor. They'll give you information on all sides of the issue. And snakes have hips.

Ultimately, however, no matter how much information you provide, there will always be some people who can never be convinced of the benefits of owning their own business. As often we hear in the business, "Some will, some won't, so what."

What an arrogant, self-serving statement. There are countless thousands who are convinced of the benefits of owning their own business and are DOING it but NOT through Amway. AMO distributors perform some specious acts of number crunching in their presentations to create the impression all other home-based businesses fail. Amway is implying that Amway is the ONLY way one can "own their own business" - part of the "Amway and the Wrong Way" mindset nurtured and rampant in AMO's.

Tuesday, May 19, 2009

Amway - The Dream Or The Scheme?

Thanks for the link Joe Cool...  I must admit that my opinion of this "opportunity" is firmed up with every turn.

Quoted from http://amwayscheme.blogspot.com/:

Amway - The Dream Or The Scheme?

Amway - How The Plan Sucks In New Recruits

I remember seeing the plan in a hotel setting for the first time. It was quite impressive and by observation, I believe the plan is pretty much presented the same way now as it was back when I was an IBO, save for the online features of ordering products.

The speaker would start out talking about "his" situation. He was in a job, but suddenly realized he wanted more in life. He also talked about how many Americans are living in debt, and that interest, inflation, income tax and insurance ate away at your paycheck. You go from work to home to work to home not thinking about it, but living in a "rut". His life was at the mercy of his alarm clock with weekends off for good behavior.

He says his life changed when some guy he barely knew called him up and asked if he would be interested in seeing a business presentation. A business that can be run part time, in your spare time. A part time business with low risk, low overhead and you can do as much or as little as you want.

The speaker then went on to mention that thru Amway, you can get products at a 30% discount and on top of that, you also get a "rebate" or "kickback" based on volume.
Thus you can either make money or at least save money by getting involved in the business. The speaker also mentioned that through partnerships, they have major brand product, etc.

All of this makes sense on the surface, until you take a more critical look as the business. For example, Amway and partner store products are not 30% cheaper than you can purchase them from Walmart or other big retailers. That is an outright lie. Also conveniently not mentioned was the cost of the foolproof system. (I hear that some groups mention the system now, but downplay the expenses associated with it). How many people would register if the speaker said upfront that you (if dedicated) would need to spend money to register, and then spend about $300 a month on products, and another $200 a month (or more) on the system? Keep in mind that couples expenses are generally double of a single person. All of this expense and work for a fraction of a 1% chance of reaching success?

Monday, May 18, 2009

Amway for Dummies

UPDATE

There is too much negativity to take this "opportunity" seriously.  It is apparent that Amway has gone through many changes over the years and have left many scars on many people.   There are several sites out there that are positive and appear to have an Amway feel to them so its uncertain who is really the author of those sites.  However, it can not possibly stand against the preponderance of bad experiences that so many seemed to have had.   All sites that I have visited were independent of each other and didn't appear to be from one person with a vendetta or an agenda. 

I am sure that some people have made money with the Amway program, but at what cost?  Anyone who is serious about Amway really needs to look at all the facts independently of Amway promotional material.  I have not looked at those numbers as my interest was lost doing this search and my need (or greed) isn't great enough to warrant further investigation. 

RESEARCH OVER

Miscellaneous Arguments and Answers about Amway

This site appears to be from someone who is objective and gets past the hype and right to the point.  Its worth reading through all the points listed if for no other reason than its entertainment value.  Regardless of which side of the fence a person is on, his responses often got a little chuckle.

Quoted from http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/argument/index.html#grateful:

Miscellaneous Arguments and Answers about Amway

Miscellaneous Arguments and Answers about Amway

Over the past years I've received a lot of attention and mail from distributors who were very eager to argue with me. During that time I've gradually come to recognize that a lot of these arguments get repeated over and over again because they're really just continuous paraphrases of things that are said on the tapes. I've grown very accustomed to the standard ammunition that distributors have at their disposal, and so I finally decided to make something like a FAQ in which I answer some of these arguments.

THE FORMAT: I usually have a specific point in mind when I begin writing. I will do my best to search my letters for one or several typical instances of the argument I want to answer; then I will summarize an Amway distributor's expected position and respond to it. If I can't find any reasonable specific quotes from distributors, I'll attempt to recite a reasonable paraphrase. I have tried to be fair and objective in stating all arguments exactly the way a real Amway proponent would say them. If you think I've stated anything in an incorrect or unfair way, please do write to me and correct it. I don't want to be setting up any "straw men" or phony positions.

Amway Company History | Amway Global

It has been pointed out that because I did not use Amway.com as a "Pro site" in my search that my results may be slanted towards the negative. Below is the Amway site. It is difficult to use Amway.com as a point of reference because we are all good at blowing our own horn.  My search is looking for independent third party positives.  In other words, to use Amway.com as a reference for evaluating Amway is self defeating.  Regardless, I post this as a positive in the interest of fairness. Please visit Amway.com if you would like to see their perspective of themselves.

Quoted from http://www.amway.com/en/about-amway/our-story:

Amway Company History | Amway Global

Our Story Begins...

Quixtar Business Analysis - a look at the Amway Quixtar business opportunity

I wonder what other large reputable companies think about Amway.

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/amway.html:

 

One must turn outside the world of business - to religion and
politics - to find people who work as hard for as little
financial reward as most Amway people do.  Forbes Magazine

Quixtar Business Analysis - a look at the Amway Quixtar business opportunity

At first my internet searching was casual yet in depth.  The more I see about the effect that Amway has had on so many people the more I am astounded that they get away with it.  Even more astounding is the fact that people still buy into it given the information that is so easily available.  Obviously Due Diligence is a forgot practice.

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/amway.html:

Quixtar Business Analysis - a look at the Amway Quixtar business opportunity

Unfortunately the 2-5 year plan is nothing more than an elusive dream and most participants will lose time with their families, and thousands of dollars a year. For many, the Amway dream turns into a personal financial nightmare as distributors spend thousands of dollars on their upline's optional but necessary support system of motivational conferences and tapes.

The general public does not take time to understand the poor overall economics of Quixtar's "buy from your self" product merchandising plan. Federal Trade Commission pyramiding regulations require companies like Amway/Quixtar and their Lines of Affiliation to sell a majority of their volume to non-distributors to avoid being an illegal pyramid scheme. In reality most distributors have no customers besides themselves. An active Quixtar distributor could spend a couple of thousand dollars and hundreds of hours per year to promote a business model that has just a few thousand dollars of sales, with most sales to the distributor himself. When you add up the actual cost of time used to promote this scheme and compare it to the volume of product sold, it is has to be the world's least efficient product marketing method. Distributors are taught "If the dream is big enough, the facts don't count". The facts make little difference to most distributors since they are taught to believe their dream is possible for anyone willing to just work hard enough and recruit enough people to the pyramid.

Sunday, May 17, 2009

AUS: Dealing With Cult Victims

The more I casually search the more I am amazed at how much this stuff is repeated.  Where is the good stuff on amway?  Is there ANYTHING at all out there that is positive.  I have considered giving up my search for anything that isn't negative but the more I read the more I am intrigued at how unpopular this business is.

 

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/aus/culthelp.htm:

AUS: Dealing With Cult Victims

Amway: The Untold Story

Dealing With Cult Victims

"We have a relative, who following a divorce, and therefore during a vulnerable time in her life, was recruited by a friend and is now involved in this scam. We are VERY concerned as she will be retiring from the workforce soon and Amway seems to be draining her financially. Your item on cultism is very applicable, as the male individual who recruited her seems to have become the male substitution for her ex- husband.... sincere, caring, believable, etc, etc.

Any assistance would be appreciated."

"One of my best friends and my cousin have recently found "new religion" (how I see it). My best friend has only amway and only talks amway. It has become his life and his financial savior. It has strained my relationship with him and his wife. He and I have been friends since high school and we were inseperable. Her and I have been friends since college we were roomates for 2 years and I introduced the two. It has strained his realtionship with our other friend and they are childhood friends and neighbors. You become part of the amway family because "know one else understands the kind of commitment that you have made" or something to that effect. On a personal level, if it's not obvious, I am angry. I feel like I have lost my best friend to a cult."

"My only real regret for that experience is the outcome of my former friendship with my sponsors. These were two people I cared for very much and truely wanted to see all the best for. But, as they are taught, "If your friends don't want to be in Amway, get new friends." Two people who I had felt very close to, and considered life long friends, appearently decided I was not worthy of their friendship. A real shame."

dreamsteal's Australian Amway loser page!

Here is more.  Please note, I am not searching for negative stuff, its just everywhere. 

Quoted from http://members.tripod.com/~dreamsteal/index.html:

dreamsteal's Australian Amway loser page!

NEW info about the Amway Internet plan at http://www.bockwall.com/dqbiz/php.htm

Hi there, I've added up above a new link to what an Amway AMO is planning on the Internet. It gives a tiny bit more info than www.countdown9199/com which is the quixstar site. Here's the rest of my page.. I'm a former Amway distributor from earlier this decade. Recently I found some fascinating web pages about the motivational organisations that supply tapes to Amway groups and how the high pin levels make money from tapes and functions. I looked for information on the Australian motivational organisations but could not find it. So I thought I'd tell my story. It all started when a parent at the local primary school wanted to show me a business opportunity. I was skeptical when the whiteboard came out and circles were drawn but did think I could market some products through my work (in a big firm) and especially liked the tax break idea for cleaning product samples etc...which turned out to be not strictly true. Anyway, I signed up and was in. I read through the manual and was worried about the 10 customer requirement, but was told not to worry about it. My sponsor and the upline people I met at my first meeting said it was more important to sponsor. I bought some tapes and books on multi-level marketing and left them with friends who were not interested, and my sponsor showed the plan to a friend who was not interested, having lived in a house with an Amway distributor. I bought loads more cleaning products than I would normally - I needed a clean house for when the directs dropped by. And I went to weekly meetings - more of that in the next section. the system creeps in...

Weekly meetings were in a large room with uncomfortable chairs in an office in an industrial area half an hour's drive away. The Diamonds did a lot of talking - I remember a suggestion to set up a Queen cookware club with six people so everyone got a piece each week.The wonders of water filtration and vacuum cleaning were explained and there was lots of circle drawing. Tapes were recommended - but I did not realise at first that they were not Amway tapes and when I ordered one about Singles in Amway through the catalogue my sponsor said I should be getting one of the other tapes. They were IBS tapes and were all basically success stories, with advice about following uplines and the system. This was System 2000 and you were meant to SUE (sell, use and eat) 200PV a month. I remember being excited when I made 3 per cent...mostly through my own purchases. I bought sheets and socks through the catalogue though I could have got them cheaper at sales. I started thinking of everyone as a potential prospect, as the system advised. But I found that got in the way of normal social interaction. I was also associating more with Amway people - we had a Christmas BBQ where kids were present (contrasting with the kid-free policies for everything else) reality sets in

After a few months I realised that I was not going to sell heaps of product to fellow workers. I recall an Amagram which celebrated a woman who had achieved 9pc on sales alone...it struck me that few would do that for her to be written up. Nor were people joining me, except for a relative who soon decided she got better value in store specials. But my upline seemed excited and happy..I was a winner..and I went to functions. These involved interstate Diamonds crowing about their overseas trips and purchases (not catalogue purchases). I had to arrange babysitting and my expenses were mounting to hundreds of dollars. Then a friend lent me the book Amway - The Cult of Free Enterprise. It was an eye opener and reflected the pattern of what I had been exposed to. My dream was still there but fading. Finally I decided not to renew.

Amway vs Quixtar: A Personal Perspective! by Robert C Potter The Ulimate Guide To Products For Resale

This is definitely worth taking the time to read all the way through. It outlines a dateline reporter that went undercover to check them out. I havent read it all yet but it looks interesting.

 

Quoted from http://searchwarp.com/swa3579.htm:

Amway vs Quixtar: A Personal Perspective! by Robert C Potter The Ulimate Guide To Products For Resale

"NOTHING HAPPENS UNTIL SOMEBODY SELLS SOMETHING!"

Despite the "No Selling" credo that was touted as one of the "Advantages Of Amway," this perception is false. When you are shown the "plan" there is a suggestion that you really don’t have to do much selling—just recruit other people to sell for you, and thus making the commission from the "down line" you build…The one exception to this rule is if you make to "direct distributor" status. You then have to carry a certain amount of product and supply for your down line.

Someone has to sell something, or nothing happens. In order for an individual to make money from the Amway/Quixtar model, your down line has to have "deep legs," and they need to be selling a lot of product in order for you to increase your point value, or "PV." Also, if you do make your mark in the business, and start getting a lot of people under you, eventually you will have to help other people sell the plan to their potential downline!

My sponsor had over 100 people in his down line, and he only made (as he later admitted) around 80 to 100 dollars a month. If no one sold anything that month, he would get nothing at all. If you took the high number (100 dollars per month) then it would fall in line with some of the average yearly income of most Amway/Quixtar distributors—about 1200 a year. Not the 250,000 part-time that Fredricks and other recruiters might tell you..

I never bothered to ask about what happens when you don’t work the business anymore, and you have a large down line. Do you still make money from the people under you? While I did not know the answer to that question, I did know this. If you have a small down line (like my sponsor did with 100 people) if just twenty of them decide to defect to another group, or sponsor, there goes your income!

Defections are another negative aspect of the business. My sponsor ran into that exact problem. Another distributor convinced some of my sponsors down line to join his organization. The rules might have changed since then, preventing people from jumping to another down line. However, if it hasn’t , and you build a substantial organization, then it can be wiped out in a matter of weeks due to mass defections to another down line.

"IS THE AMWAY BUSINESS A CULT?"

It has been suggested that the Amway/Quixtar business is a "cult." I would say that the "Heaven’s Gate" consortium of UFO nuts, started by a man named Marshall Applewhite, a.k.a., "Do" (pronounced "Doe") by his disciples, was a cult. In addition to their bizarre beliefs about "other beings," they came to the conclusion that the "Hale-Bopp" comet was a spaceship, and a sign from another planet that this was their ride into the "Heavens" beyond the earthly realm.

In order to get your ticket punched to "galactic nirvana", they needed to check out from planet earth. Over 30 of it’s members committed suicide in the belief that their spirit, would be whisked aboard the ship that was passing through galaxy, via the "Hale-Bopp" express.

IN NO WAY does the Amway/Quixtar business come close to that kind of "outer limits" thinking. In the time that I was involved with Amway, the message was the same. Keep negative influences out of your life, limit your exposure to news, and television, attend seminars and buy tapes.

I never witnessed any extreme devotion to the Amway business. Most of the stories of people who have went broke spending money on tapes and seminars are purely anecdotal. I am not saying that they are not true, I am saying that I never personally experienced that type of extremism. Such experiences can be found at websites like MLMSurvivor.com.

Quixtar Criminals

Follow this link and read it.... Its probably biased but worth the look.

Quoted from http://quixtarcriminals.blogspot.com/:

Quixtar Criminals

Quixtar Criminals

This Blog is in honor of my son Jonas. You can find all the information you need, to know Quixtar spells doom for you and your family, in the end. There are so many things wrong with this organization, why risk it? Though you can find in depth information on all of Quixtar's shady practices and possible illegalities, my focus is the personal stories of how really bad it can get, how you can lose everything of value to you and your family. It's a crime!

Amway Quixtar Business Myths - Links

There are lots of links here.  This appears to be from a person in favor of MLM.

Quoted from http://www.amquix.info/amway_10.html:

Amway Quixtar Business Myths - Links

Links - Discussion groups

MLM Survivors Club at Yahoo.com - A discussion board for ex-MLM'er
Quixtar or Tools Blog Discussion Board
http://books.dreambook.com/hunza1/ambook.html
http://quixtarcriminals.blogspot.com/

MLM RELATED LINKS

 

http://www.ozamwayvictims.blogspot.com/
On the Road with Dave blog
Joe Cool's Blog
Rocket's Rants Blog
Quixtar Deamons Blog
Quixtar inside and out Blog
Quixtar Amway infiltrator
State Attorney General Websites
Pyramid Scheme Alert.org
Amway the Untold Story Mirror site - The first Internet site about the Real Amway by Sidney Schwartz.
Merchants of Deception
MLM Observer (German)
The Nightmare-builders
The Other Side of the plan Mirror Site - A great site covering numerous sides of the Amway experience.
Welcome to Amway: The Continuing Story
What is Good? How do I know if a particular MLM is pyramidal? By Dr. John M Taylor
http://www.falseprofits.com - A site for the book "False Prophets", detailing "The 10 Big Lies of MLM".
Myth and the Amway Experience
The God of the Bible versus the god of multi-level marketing - Reviews the conflicts of MLM and the Church.
The Perils of Amway
What's wrong with MLM
WWDB: The Things They Will Say. . .
http://www.lclark.edu/~soan/sp/chintro1.html
Dreamstealers
Religious Movements - Amway as a Para-Religion
Amway UK Rip-Off
The Amway Files
Watchtower BORG Spectator, a site about the Britt organization.
The truth about Amway and E-commerce
WoldwideScam.com
The MLM Law Website
Rick Ross.com Cult intervention consultant and expert
http://www.rickross.com/groups/amway.html
Used Amway Tapes for Sale - Site specializing in a secondary market for used Amway AMO materials.
A great page about MLM's
My three years in Amway The Amway/Quixtar memory hole
The Amway Dreamers page
Amway a personal perspective
http://www.antiamway.info/
WWW.PYRAMIDSCHEMES.ORG 

 

 

Rip-off Report: AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

This is from someone who claims to have done some research on it.  Please read the entire article.  His methodology appears unbiased and informed.  Will look into this one further. 

Quoted from http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/003/RipOff0003443.htm:

Rip-off Report: AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

AMWAY OR SCAMWAY

You decide....

I am not a winner, nor a loser, just your average intelligent college student who joined AMWAY. I joined a year ago after a friend of one of my roommates showed me the plan. I have seen the business inside and out. Now I want to make it clear to all those considering joining amway.

Why AMWAY works....

Amway works because every individual who joins, learns the art of social engineering. 'Social Engineering' is the term a that a famous computer hacker named CitiZen-0ne coined. Social Engineering is the Art of Influence, Manipulation and lying. In other words it is the Mastery of bullshitting others into thinking or believing any thing they want you to believe.

Every single successful distributor who has 'plugged into the system' has learned this art. They KNOW every single question question you are going to ask before you ask it, and they know how to answer it in a Myriad of different ways. They know how to answer your questions and what to tell you, to convince you into believing them. They even sell tapes and other various information through the company so that you can learn all these skills. I challenge you to go talk to someone who is fairly successful in the business. Let them show you the plan and then ask them questions and if your sharp you will catch all the mind games, the well rehearsed answers to common questions and the sneaky escapes they perfectly execute in tight situations. AMWAY is the college of 'Social Engineering'. They will try to convince you and get you excited. Once they get you excited and convinced you end up joining and becoming a student at the college of AMWAY studying 'Social Engineering' and if you master this Major at U. OF AMway you can make a relatively decent salary. IF you get a PhD in Deception, you will get a diamond pin to wear on your colar or lapel. GO DIAMOND, BREAK 7!!!

Events are thrown as often as every week, the purpose of these cult events is to get you HIGH. The speakers at these events are usually high ranking individuals who speak so 'Elequently' or even so 'Down to Earth'. They play on your dreams and hopes of success in the world. They get your blood and heart pumping with all kinds of chants and other audience participation things. They make the business seem so easy. They get people from the audience who have gone to certain levels walk across the stage so you can see how many people actually move up in the business. They tell you all kinds of inspiring statistics so that you get 'FIRED UP', 'IM FIRED UP, HOW 'BOUT YOU?'. They will tell you how many billions of dollars amway did and any other things that have worked in scamming people in to the business. They tell you about there good times in life and there bad times, so that you can relate to them emotionally. Because all of us have been through good and bad times in life, DONT YOU JUST FEEL THE UNITY! (By the way all things in Capital letters are things actually chanted or spoken with religious conviction at these events).

All the chanting and inspiration from hese 'successful' individuals in amway makes you a believer and soon you find these meetings or big events are your only escape from a business smart society where the majority of common people can see through the false illusions of Amway. These meetings or events become addictive, they become your safe haven, the place where you can feel unity with all the other foot soldiers of failure and even success. Soon you become friends with these other individuals and you slowly begin to see amway consume your life. Amway promises freedom, but in truth you get trapped in a business that you might end up peddling for the rest of your life. They Speak of Freedom to do as you want and when you want. Common Catch phrases 'They speak of being free and roaming the beaches of the world.' Actually you are getting trapped in a business that you will have to peddle forever.

Saturday, May 16, 2009

I have read the book

At first I was hesitant to read the nook I pointed out earlier because I knew it had a negative slant to it. I really wanted to get an open and unbiased perspective of Amway based on sites both positive and negative. This has become a challenge. There are and extreme amount of negative sites and nearly no positive sites at all. This book somewhat points out why that may be. Here is a ink to the book:


Friday, May 15, 2009

Amway Links

It appears that I am not alone in my search for positive Amway sites

Quoted from http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/amlinks.html:

Amway Links

Your web page here
I want to see more pro-Amway sites crop up so people can do an honest comparison. In the past I've seen a number of Amway fan sites come and go, most of them smarmy, hostile, and refusing to display any letters expressing opposing viewpoints, as this site does. Recently, though, there has been a shortage of favorable Amway sites of any kind. This is partly due to a restriction, recently lifted, that Amway had on self-promotion by internet. Now that this is no longer an issue, by all means try to prove me wrong if you want. If you've seen any other good places for me to link here, please pass them along and I'll add them when I get around to it.

Amway Quixtar Insider Documents Massive Consumer Fraud

This seems to be more credible than other sources as this is a person who achieved Emerald status with Amway.  There is an option to download his book which I will do and comment on when I have more time.... still looking for positive sites that are independent and not advertising for Amway.

Quoted from http://www.merchantsofdeception.com/:

Amway Quixtar Insider Documents Massive Consumer Fraud

I am not a person who “tried” Amway and failed but rather someone who built the business with great passion and enthusiasm to the coveted Founder’s Emerald level. After nearly a decade of recruiting many good, honorable people into “the business”, including my own father, I made disturbing discoveries.

After a decade of investing in this, I was the last one on earth who wanted to discover and then document nearly a 99% loss rate for consumers induced to “invest in their own Amway business”.
 

I was a loyal, trusting IBO for almost a decade, building an international
Amway / Quixtar business. Following protocol, I relayed these facts directly to Amway / Quixtar corporation senior management and the shocking events that followed revelations of IBO deception are chronicled in detail in the free book Merchants of Deception.

Why have Dateline NBC, Business Week, Forbes, ITV (Europe) and others interviewed me regarding Merchants of Deception? That answer and many more are in the book itself.

The Real Amway Global: Amway Global in 2009: Aiming for a Comeback

This is from an anti-Amway site.  Keep in mind, I am not looking for negative or positive sites.  I am searching generically.  I am still seeing many more negative sites compared to positive sites.  In fact, because I am finding so few positive sites I am going to start looking for them specifically to try and get some balance.

Quoted from http://destroyamway.blogspot.com/2008/12/amway-global-in-2009-aiming-for.html:

The Real Amway Global: Amway Global in 2009: Aiming for a Comeback

Wednesday, December 31, 2008

One of the big ironies of 2008 is that the recession, largely created by GOP economic policies and an incompetent Bush administration, has created an opportunity for a GOP-dominated Ponzi scheme: Amway Global. In the past few months, Alticor, Amway's parent company has devoted millions to television commercials, newspaper ads, and market research. People who lost their jobs or who fear unemployment are undoubtedly attracted to Amway's slick ads. I think this is a tragedy. The overwhelming majority of people who join will be worse off financially. Amway Global is not as big of a Ponzi scheme as Bernard Madoff's $50 billion Ponzi scheme but it is in the billions.

Scoop: Teflon Amway - 20 Years Of Crime & Lawsuits

I knew that Amway had been sued and it had something to do with the Federal Trade Commision.  I had no idea that the information put forth in the remainder of this post was out there.  A further search into the actual court cases should prove interesting.

I found this on http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0501/S00074.htm

From The Amway Consumer Fraud Scandal Series
By Evelyn Pringle
Miamisburg, OH

The paperwork involved in the endless stream of lawsuits filed against Amway and its Kingpin distributors over the past 2 decades would probably fill a 10 story office building. The complaints and discovery documents filed in these actions, which Amway has fought so hard to keep hidden, outline 20 years of fraud perpetrated on millions of unwitting and vulnerable recruits all over the world

 

There have been so many suits filed, that the company's attorneys can't even come up with an exact number. In 1985, Amway Diamond Rick Setzer sued Amway. During the discovery process, in a request for production of documents, Setzer's attorneys asked for:

"Copies of all lawsuits filed against Amway corporation and or Richard DeVos and or Jay VanAndel for the past 10 years."

This was Amway's response, in part:

"The request imposes an undue burden in that the number of lawsuits filed against Amway Corporation and/or Richard DeVos and/or Jay Van Andel for the past ten years represents literally thousands of lawsuits, with the file on each lawsuit varying from several pages to entire rooms filled with documentation." Affidavit in Support of Defendants' Objections to Plaintiffs' First Request For Production of Documents.

Even if “thousands” only means 2000, over 10 years that means 200 law suits were filed each year. That number is astronomical when you consider that the number of distributors who actually go so far as to file a lawsuit is but a small percentage of the actual number of distributors who fall victim to Amway each year.

If people took the time to read the records contained in these lawsuits, they would find a common theme: Amway is a pyramid scheme; the tools business is a pyramid scheme; recruits are lured in by exaggerated income claims and flamboyant displays of wealth; retail selling is ignored in favor of self-consumption of Amway products; distributors and potential distributors are pressured to buy tools and tickets to motivational rallies.

Founder Jay Van Andel's former speechwriter, Don Gregory, described how Amway preys on new recruits. "Recruits are brainwashed into spending a fortune on peripherals while consuming Amway products. They either lose their shirts or begin making money by getting enough people underneath to do the same," he said.

Eric Scheibeler is a former Amway insider turned whistleblower and FBI witness who has written a book about his experiences in Amway, entitled Merchants of Deception. (A free advance copy of the book, Merchant's of Deception, may be downloaded for a limited time at www.merchantsofdeception.com).

According to Eric, the 1970 FTC ruling requires that the majority of products going through a MLM must be sold to an end consumer (a non distributor) in order to not be considered an illegal pyramid scheme. This is referred to as the retail sales rule. Yet Eric says that he and his wife were taught to build a business that relied almost entirely on self consumption, which he has since learned is illegal.

A prime example of this excessive sales for self-consumption is still going on today, 30 years after the FTC issued its ruling, is the July, 2004, IRS case against Amway distributors, Kay and Randall Ollett. When testifying, Kay told the court that about 70-75% of their sales were a result of products purchased by her and her husband for their own use. The Olletts purchased almost all of their household products through their distributorship, including soap, shampoo, deodorant, dish-washing liquid, detergent, facial products, food items such as health food bars and energy drinks, a water treatment system, and even clothing such as men’s socks, slacks, and sport shirts. The Tax Court ruled against the Olletts and would not allow the couple to claim tax deductions for expenses related to their Amway activity.

Eric also explains how the "tools" business of selling books, tapes, and videos is also an illegal pyramid because it is a closed system and no product is ever sold at retail to a consumer outside the group. Which means recruits unknowingly become involved in not one, but two illegal pyramids, when they join Amway, according to Eric.

The downline distributors are never told that their upline is making as much or more from the sale of tools as they are from the sale of products. The distributors assume that the lifestyles of their upline are attributable to their Amway businesses, and buy more tools hoping to achieve the same success.

So it becomes a never-ending cycle: the more tools the downline distributors buy, the more successful upline distributors appear; which in turn motivates downline distributors to buy more tools. Over 99% of low level distributors eventually quit, or go broke trying to hang on long enough reach a level where they too can get a cut of the tools profits.

In the 1998 New Hampshire case of Lavoie v Yager, Ruby directs alleged that their upline cut them off from the tools profits, and also alleged unfair trade practices, illegal chain distribution scheme, interference with advantageous relations, securities fraud, under the RICO Act. The complaint in this case is unique in that it contains details on the inner working of Kingpin Dexter Yager's system, and it also follows the progression of a distributor through the system.

Another wealth of insider information can be found in the 1998 Morrison v Amway suit. 29 distributors filed a lawsuit and revealed many of Amway's best-kept secrets. The suit alleges that the distributors make the majority of their income selling tools rather than products and that distributors in the downlines are coerced into spending money on tapes and functions by being told that they have no chance of success unless they do. It also alleges that tools profits are used to control and coerce downline distributors, and that those who ask questions or refuse to play the game risk having their businesses destroyed

The 1998 Vernon v Amway case seems to substantiate Eric Scheileber's claim that Amway recruits unknowingly become part of 2 illegal schemes when they join Amway. This case sought damages incurred by: fraudulent inducement in causing plaintiffs to participate in an illegal scheme to purchase and sell motivational tapes and tickets to Amway events; and conspiracy to fraudulently induce them to enter into an agreement to execute what they believed to be an Amway Sales Plan.

Interns Expose Amway

This seems to be interesting.  Not sure what to think about it though.  Take time to watch the videos!

 

Quoted from http://interns.opportunityzone.com/:

Interns Expose Amway

Wheres the Beef???

I have been accused of having a closed mind and reading only what I want to read about Amway.  This could not be any further from the truth.  In my research for the truth about Amway, I started with a simple Google search with the name "Amway" in the search box.  The first top 2 entries were for Amway.com and their business websites. The 3rd entry was a wikipedia definition that was flagged for deletion because it was accused of sounding like an advertisement.  The following 7 returned hits were from sites with a negative slant to them accusing fraud and showing negativity and controversy.  The following pages all contained more of the same.  Overall, about 9 tenths of the results that occupied the first few pages were negative. The other 10 percent that was not negative were comprised of the Amway home sites and one for an unbiased history of Amway.  Of the websites reviewed so far none were independently positive.


Amway. Quiztar, TEAM, Team of Destiny, Network 21 - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com

I encourage you to read the complete article as it appears this is based on facts and actual numbers and is also recent as of February, 2009.

 

Quoted from http://www.skepdic.com/amway.html:

Amway. Quiztar, TEAM, Team of Destiny, Network 21 - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com

Amway® (Quixtar®) (Team of Destiny®)

 (TEAM®) (Network 21)

Amway is the largest multi-level marketing (MLM) organization in the world. It is a multi-billion dollar a year company based on the sale of products as varied as soap, water purifiers, vitamins, and cosmetics. Amway proponents are fond of asserting that their products are of the highest quality, their company is very large (several million distributors and several billion dollars in annual sales), and does business with such giants as Coca-Cola and MCI (bought by Verizon).

In Amway, one is recruited as an "independent" distributor of Amway products by buying a couple of hundred dollars' worth of the products from the one who recruits you, known as your "upline." Every distributor in turn tries to recruit more distributors. Income is generated by sales of products by the distributor plus "bonuses" from sales of his or her recruits and their recruit-descendents.

Here is a description from an Amway distributor as to how it works.

It goes like this:

If I buy $200 of stuff from Amway this month, I'll get a 3% bonus check (3% of $200 = $6). If I share the opportunity with nine others, and we each buy $200 of stuff from Amway this month, they each were responsible for $200 and will get $6, but I'm responsible for $2000, moving me to the 12% level. I get $240. However, I'm responsible for paying the bonuses of the people right below me - $54 - so I keep $186. I make more because I did more, I found nine people who wanted to buy at a discount and get a bonus for doing it. After I reach the 25% bonus level there are other bonuses that kick in, but they're all based on the volume of product flow, not on signing people up or having lots of people (Bob Queenan, personal correspondence). [April 7, 2004. Gary Elliot Murway writes: Please correct: distributors/IBOs no longer need to pay downline bonuses. Quixtar can pay each IBO directly.]

Amway defenders take offense at describing this method of sales and recruitment as akin to a pyramid or chain letter scheme. It is true that MLM as practiced by Amway is not an illegal pyramid scheme. Amway has been taken to court for being an illegal pyramid and the courts have ruled that since Amway does not charge people either for joining Amway or for the privilege of recruiting others as distributors, it is not an illegal pyramid. Illegal pyramids and chain letters have no product. Amway has lots of household products: from laundry detergent to vitamins, from cosmetics to water filters. Amway is a legal pyramid scheme.

Amway - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is from wikipedia - It has been marked for deletion because it was written as an advertisement.

 

Quoted from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amway:

Amway - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Amway is a direct selling company that uses multi-level marketing or network marketing to promote its products.[3][4][5]

Amway was founded in 1959 by Jay Van Andel and Richard DeVos. Based in Ada, Michigan, the company and family of companies under Alticor reported sales growth of 15%, reaching US$8.4 billion for the year ending December 31, 2008.[1] Its product lines include home care products, personal care products, jewelry, electronics, Nutrilite dietary supplements, water purifiers, air purifiers, insurance and cosmetics. In 2004, Health & Beauty products accounted for nearly 60% of worldwide sales.[6] Amway conducts business through a number of affiliated companies in more than ninety countries and territories around the world.[7] It is ranked by Forbes as one of the largest private companies in the United States[8] and by Deloitte as one of the largest retailers in the world.[9]

The Perils of Amway

Quoted from http://www.apollowebworks.com/amway/:

The Perils of Amway

 

The true story of how Amway changed my life...
by letting me get away from them

Hi there, my name is Russell Glasser and back in 1996, I almost got involved with a large and enticing "business opportunity" called Amway. This is the story of my introduction to, research of, and departure from the Amway corporation.

Originally written as a lark to amuse friends and relatives, this web page has generated considerable notoriety and entertaining commentary from thousands of complete strangers. I welcome you. If you know me and want to read about something that strongly influenced my character, by all means read this story. If you are confused about Amway and want to hear one person's perspective on whether it's a good opportunity, read the story. But if you're an Amway distributor looking for new recruits, go away. Trust me, I am not worth your time.

If you have never visited "The Perils of Amway" before, you should click on "Russell's Story" at the top of the page so you can read about my experience and motivation for talking about Amway. After that, feel free to surf around this site at will. The feedback section is especially interesting to many people.

Since around about May 1997, thousands of people have looked at this page. Frightening, isn't it?